My Story before Cesar...
Thank you Cesar!
I'm Creating this site because like many of you I got the Help of Cesar Millan with my first Dog and this is my Way to say: Thank you Cesar!
Cesar have now more than Six yrs. of his Reality Show on the National Geographic channel, 4 Hours at day, his Reality Show currently airs in more than 100 Countries, His first three books, all New York Times best sellers, have cumulatively sold two million copies in the United States and are available in 14 other countries. now Millons of peple are looking his dogs like dogs and not like people in fur coats.
I try to say Thank you Cesar in others forums, then some thing happened, I was called "Stupid, Ignorant, Moron" because I made my dog "fearful" "helpless" and as if it were a Curse, they profetize that it would not last the "Quick fix", that my dog will become "Agressive" and "Dangerous"
Certanly was Not a "Quick Fix" and 6 years Later, Still I'm waiting that "terrible Day" when my dog Turn into a "Monster" and bite any one who become in contact with her every day!.... NOT A CHANCE!
Before Cesar I used positive training with my dog and it was not so bad, I mean I knew that I could teach to my dog to do tricks with this approach!
When I was a kid,I was amazed by the tricks that a dogs performed on a circus, I remember that when I asked how they can do it, I was told that was using rewards, "when the dog performed the trick he get his reward." I was told.
And guess what?
My first contact and "advice" on dog training come directly from... Ian Dunbar
But, guess what?
DID NOT WORK!
I mean, I was able to teach some basic tricks, but with other kind of misbehaviours, simply did not work!
I'm Not against Rewards in training, rewards are a efective way to teach behaviours, but when you have misbehaviours related to Leadership and Pack structure, and a Strong Bond with your dog, is Not the Correct approach.
Then, I happened across Cesar Millan on the National Geographic channel, I learned more from Cesar in two hours than reading Ian Dunbar and others books for one month!
All my past experiences with dogs made sense, his advice, WORKED with my dog Then and Now with my relatives and friends dogs.
When I got my dog, a Lab Retriever, I try to get all information that I can and btw my First article/advise about how train my dog come directly from... Ian Dunbar.
How about that eh!....
Called 'On good behaviour' where besides of Preach his Dogma and his 1-800-Mob/Like association APDT, he try to teach his New Age Hippie Bribery, which appear to work only to teach Circus Tricks, but , with serious bad behaviours simply DO NOT WORK!
Well, Sit and Stay Do Not Work for the misbehaviour of my dog (2 yrs of that she also learned some basic tricks), but after give her structure, I was able to correct all her bad Behaviours, She pick it quick and easy No Pain, No Fear, No Distress was used and after 6 yrs she is better than ever
I found that any one who try their Only "pure positive" method and if don't work, those Acolytes Blame the owner/trainer for the failure and call them "Idiots" "Stupid'' "Ignorants" or at last "Uneducated Morons"
I'm not against "positive reinforcement."
What I'm against is this kind of rose-colored-glasses attitude toward what can actually be a very negative, and even harmful experience for some dogs.
I hate some things like Hypocresy and some of those people exudes it.
Both in their dealings with the public and their dealings with other trainers, who subscribe to more balance in their approach, I find many of it's practitioners to be Arrogant, Zealous and Dishonest.
I want to make it clear that my remarks are directed primarily at the Evangelical promoters and the Zealous Fanatics within this movement.
The Statements and Position against other methods, approach, phylosophies on behaviour modification and training made for those Pigeons, sounds like the position from those Religious Fundamentalists, those who Preach Our Way is the ONLY way, WE are the Holders of the Truth.
Only to them is given the revelation of the "truth".
The ultimate Moral Vision, on training called "pure positive", "Friendly", "Humane" becomes the Ultimate "science" and the person who dares to Criticise it, or even think Criticism, is Immoral, Unethic Irreverent and "Unscientific".
Thought Reform at Work!
I'll be exposing my observations about the subjet on the Conspirasy thread....
Because I had Invested a LOT of Time on research and I had been read countless books, studies, articles, blogs, posts comming from ALL positions of the dog training phylosophy, I'll be quoting and making use of comments from other users, I'll be given the credit whenever were posible or in a later time.
I grab sources from what I consider as personal experience to be a point of view Worth Mentioning.
I'm making of that Words useful tools against the Misleading claims and Lies.
Like this one:
- "Of the academic behaviorists I've discussed this with, some have said that in their world, they enjoy a good laugh over how animal trainers misuse clicker training and misinterpret behavioral science.
One told me that, in his opinion, even Karen Pryor doesn't understand it completely. And yet we expect our clients to "get" it?
Go figure."
There is NOTHING in the "scientific", "pure positive", "Friendly", "Humane" "Gentle" or whatever other Appeal to Gullible Slogan they put before the word Method that Prove that approach is better than any other Method, Non more Reliable or more Effective.
Even you Can Not say that there is a real meaning for the "positive training", "positive training" is a Commercial Product not a method of training, it has no definable meaning in the context of dog training
There is NO GUARANTEE for that Philosophy
"Refrain from giving guarantees regarding the outcome of training, because there is NO Sure Way to Guarantee the Cooperation and Performance of all parties involved and because the Knowledge of Animal Behavior is Incomplete."
"There are NO Guarantees. Because of the variable and often Unpredictable"
"Nature of Behavior, a conscientious trainer cannot and Will Not Guarantee the
Results of Training." - The APDT Pigeons and AVSAB
(you only go to find this in the fine print... of course! They aren't That Stupid)
ALL the claims of those bashers already has been Severely Flawed for me and others and because the most of those
Pigueons Fundamentalists of the "pure positive" phylosophy in their Delusion of knowledge, they ask to any one who openly praise and support Cesar, for "scientific studies" that support their position thowards Cesar, like if you must have a degree in Behaviourism in order to understand why Cesar approach ACCTUALLY WORKED WITH YOUR DOG! ... But there is more, even when the Proof, the Truth of Your own experience is overwhelming, they end saying to you that doesn't count because the change on the behaviour on your dog, was not performed by a "certified" dog trainer/behaviourist.
People like those Pigueons of the "pure positive" training are Moronic Hypocrites, on one hand enjoying all the benefits that science provide and at the same time Poo-Pooing other aspects of science they don't like.
And more if we take on account that Ethology and Behaviourism are NOT Exact Science.
Cesar have now more than Six yrs. of his Reality Show on the National Geographic channel, 4 Hours at day, his Reality Show currently airs in more than 100 Countries, His first three books, all New York Times best sellers, have cumulatively sold two million copies in the United States and are available in 14 other countries. now Millons of peple are looking his dogs like dogs and not like people in fur coats.
I try to say Thank you Cesar in others forums, then some thing happened, I was called "Stupid, Ignorant, Moron" because I made my dog "fearful" "helpless" and as if it were a Curse, they profetize that it would not last the "Quick fix", that my dog will become "Agressive" and "Dangerous"
Certanly was Not a "Quick Fix" and 6 years Later, Still I'm waiting that "terrible Day" when my dog Turn into a "Monster" and bite any one who become in contact with her every day!.... NOT A CHANCE!
Before Cesar I used positive training with my dog and it was not so bad, I mean I knew that I could teach to my dog to do tricks with this approach!
When I was a kid,I was amazed by the tricks that a dogs performed on a circus, I remember that when I asked how they can do it, I was told that was using rewards, "when the dog performed the trick he get his reward." I was told.
And guess what?
My first contact and "advice" on dog training come directly from... Ian Dunbar
But, guess what?
DID NOT WORK!
I mean, I was able to teach some basic tricks, but with other kind of misbehaviours, simply did not work!
I'm Not against Rewards in training, rewards are a efective way to teach behaviours, but when you have misbehaviours related to Leadership and Pack structure, and a Strong Bond with your dog, is Not the Correct approach.
Then, I happened across Cesar Millan on the National Geographic channel, I learned more from Cesar in two hours than reading Ian Dunbar and others books for one month!
All my past experiences with dogs made sense, his advice, WORKED with my dog Then and Now with my relatives and friends dogs.
When I got my dog, a Lab Retriever, I try to get all information that I can and btw my First article/advise about how train my dog come directly from... Ian Dunbar.
How about that eh!....
Called 'On good behaviour' where besides of Preach his Dogma and his 1-800-Mob/Like association APDT, he try to teach his New Age Hippie Bribery, which appear to work only to teach Circus Tricks, but , with serious bad behaviours simply DO NOT WORK!
Well, Sit and Stay Do Not Work for the misbehaviour of my dog (2 yrs of that she also learned some basic tricks), but after give her structure, I was able to correct all her bad Behaviours, She pick it quick and easy No Pain, No Fear, No Distress was used and after 6 yrs she is better than ever
I found that any one who try their Only "pure positive" method and if don't work, those Acolytes Blame the owner/trainer for the failure and call them "Idiots" "Stupid'' "Ignorants" or at last "Uneducated Morons"
I'm not against "positive reinforcement."
What I'm against is this kind of rose-colored-glasses attitude toward what can actually be a very negative, and even harmful experience for some dogs.
I hate some things like Hypocresy and some of those people exudes it.
Both in their dealings with the public and their dealings with other trainers, who subscribe to more balance in their approach, I find many of it's practitioners to be Arrogant, Zealous and Dishonest.
I want to make it clear that my remarks are directed primarily at the Evangelical promoters and the Zealous Fanatics within this movement.
The Statements and Position against other methods, approach, phylosophies on behaviour modification and training made for those Pigeons, sounds like the position from those Religious Fundamentalists, those who Preach Our Way is the ONLY way, WE are the Holders of the Truth.
Only to them is given the revelation of the "truth".
The ultimate Moral Vision, on training called "pure positive", "Friendly", "Humane" becomes the Ultimate "science" and the person who dares to Criticise it, or even think Criticism, is Immoral, Unethic Irreverent and "Unscientific".
Thought Reform at Work!
I'll be exposing my observations about the subjet on the Conspirasy thread....
Because I had Invested a LOT of Time on research and I had been read countless books, studies, articles, blogs, posts comming from ALL positions of the dog training phylosophy, I'll be quoting and making use of comments from other users, I'll be given the credit whenever were posible or in a later time.
I grab sources from what I consider as personal experience to be a point of view Worth Mentioning.
I'm making of that Words useful tools against the Misleading claims and Lies.
Like this one:
- "Of the academic behaviorists I've discussed this with, some have said that in their world, they enjoy a good laugh over how animal trainers misuse clicker training and misinterpret behavioral science.
One told me that, in his opinion, even Karen Pryor doesn't understand it completely. And yet we expect our clients to "get" it?
Go figure."
There is NOTHING in the "scientific", "pure positive", "Friendly", "Humane" "Gentle" or whatever other Appeal to Gullible Slogan they put before the word Method that Prove that approach is better than any other Method, Non more Reliable or more Effective.
Even you Can Not say that there is a real meaning for the "positive training", "positive training" is a Commercial Product not a method of training, it has no definable meaning in the context of dog training
There is NO GUARANTEE for that Philosophy
"Refrain from giving guarantees regarding the outcome of training, because there is NO Sure Way to Guarantee the Cooperation and Performance of all parties involved and because the Knowledge of Animal Behavior is Incomplete."
"There are NO Guarantees. Because of the variable and often Unpredictable"
"Nature of Behavior, a conscientious trainer cannot and Will Not Guarantee the
Results of Training." - The APDT Pigeons and AVSAB
(you only go to find this in the fine print... of course! They aren't That Stupid)
ALL the claims of those bashers already has been Severely Flawed for me and others and because the most of those
Pigueons Fundamentalists of the "pure positive" phylosophy in their Delusion of knowledge, they ask to any one who openly praise and support Cesar, for "scientific studies" that support their position thowards Cesar, like if you must have a degree in Behaviourism in order to understand why Cesar approach ACCTUALLY WORKED WITH YOUR DOG! ... But there is more, even when the Proof, the Truth of Your own experience is overwhelming, they end saying to you that doesn't count because the change on the behaviour on your dog, was not performed by a "certified" dog trainer/behaviourist.
People like those Pigueons of the "pure positive" training are Moronic Hypocrites, on one hand enjoying all the benefits that science provide and at the same time Poo-Pooing other aspects of science they don't like.
And more if we take on account that Ethology and Behaviourism are NOT Exact Science.
"I believe in integrity. Dogs have it. Humans are sometimes lacking it." ~ Cesar Millan
99% of the bad behaviour can be corrected or modificated just some "positive trainers" and Radical Behaviourists are blindsight and too stuborn to acept a sligh deviation to anothers methods that they consider against they Dogma with consecuenses beyond of "punishment"
If their method don't work, they find some Vague and Unprovable genetic, behavioral, or social Excuse to Blame the Dog, and Kill it (thus destroying the evidence of their failure) rather than send the dog to Anyone who Does Not Do what they do, Believe what they believe, or Practice what they preach...Dead Dogs Tell No Tales.
One of the best things Cesar's show did was bring all of these nasties out of the woodword where're they've hung themselves with their own wagging tongues.
1. Exercise (how terrible!! The brute!!)
2. Boundries and limitations. ie. discipline (ooohh the monster!!)
3. Affection. (Is there no end to that man's cruelty!!).
The "theory" crowd have always tried to lord their book and hypothosis learnin' over those Results Based folks who deal with the Fallout of how those lab theories Fail in the Real World.
The "theory" crowd mostly sticks to "radical behaviorism" views and refuses to acknowledge that Social Learning or some of the other sciences have any impact on a dog's behavior at all. Just remember the next time one of these Bookworms tells you to Put your Dog Down for some Vague, Unprovable Diagnosis, that those letters after their name and All the book learnin' in the world is NO measure of Intelligence, Real Life Experience, or Character as a Human Being.
Cesar has brought many people to the realization that their dog can be trained, that problems can be minimized and overcome. He does not expel energy on condemning or criticizing anyone, but shows appreciation for all who help dogs in today difficult world.
If their method don't work, they find some Vague and Unprovable genetic, behavioral, or social Excuse to Blame the Dog, and Kill it (thus destroying the evidence of their failure) rather than send the dog to Anyone who Does Not Do what they do, Believe what they believe, or Practice what they preach...Dead Dogs Tell No Tales.
One of the best things Cesar's show did was bring all of these nasties out of the woodword where're they've hung themselves with their own wagging tongues.
1. Exercise (how terrible!! The brute!!)
2. Boundries and limitations. ie. discipline (ooohh the monster!!)
3. Affection. (Is there no end to that man's cruelty!!).
The "theory" crowd have always tried to lord their book and hypothosis learnin' over those Results Based folks who deal with the Fallout of how those lab theories Fail in the Real World.
The "theory" crowd mostly sticks to "radical behaviorism" views and refuses to acknowledge that Social Learning or some of the other sciences have any impact on a dog's behavior at all. Just remember the next time one of these Bookworms tells you to Put your Dog Down for some Vague, Unprovable Diagnosis, that those letters after their name and All the book learnin' in the world is NO measure of Intelligence, Real Life Experience, or Character as a Human Being.
Cesar has brought many people to the realization that their dog can be trained, that problems can be minimized and overcome. He does not expel energy on condemning or criticizing anyone, but shows appreciation for all who help dogs in today difficult world.